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XLR 2006 - Top and Trunk will not Open

67K views 94 replies 14 participants last post by  Googoo1964 
#1 ·
I’m the original owner of a 2006 XLR, with approximately 37K miles. I recently come across a problem with the Top and Trunk that I will explain.

Recently, (2-05-12), I was going to drive with the top down and proceeded to open the trunk and placed the luggage barrier in the locked position. After closing the trunk, I started the engine, and proceeded to engage the hard top mechanism to place the top down. As I pressed the button, the barrier flap started to open, and the top attempted to open, but then the process stopped.

I attempted to reset the top mechanism by starting the process over again. I attempted to press the close button, and restarted the process. The top failed to open again with the same result. I noticed that there was a message on the dashboard indicating that the “TOP NOT SECURE”.

At this point, I turned off the engine, and proceeded to open the trunk to investigate the potential problem. I attempted to open the trunk in the normal process using the FOB and/or the sensor mechanism above the license plate. The trunk attempted to open, but the process failed and closed again. I tried this several times with the same result. I can hear the motors attempting to open the trunk.

I tried using the key to open the trunk (Done this before), but I could not turn the key to open the trunk manually. There appears to be some part of the mechanism that is jammed that will allow me to do this.

I have taken the car to the dealership and they are currently trying to diagnose the problem. I received a message from them indicating that they will need more time to figure the problem; it appears to be troublesome and will try to get some additional expertise to help diagnose this problem. This appears to be a very bad situation.

I read some posts on the forum describing some similar problems which describes the looking at the hydraulics in the trunk, but the trunk is not accessible. I have also read about S/W updates to make the Top operating sequence more efficient that may be part of the problem.

At this point, any diagnostics or fixes to resolving this issue needs to be done externally to fix this problem. I’m sure I’m not the only one to have this problem before, so I would appreciate any expertise and potential remedies that would assist.

Thanks,

SAM
 
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#2 · (Edited)
Hi Sam,

This sounds a lot like a sensor issue. You didn't mention if your dealership has a certified XLR tech. If not, I would recommend finding one.

A five-minute Tech 2 scan tool check will indicate the status of the latches, switches, and actual sensor position values which can be easily compared to the expected values. Knowing how the top is supposed to operate and looking at the indications on the Tech 2 should lead to a diagnosis within as little as fifteen minutes. The top is actually pretty easy to troubleshoot if you have the right tools. This is why I asked about the availability of a certified XLR tech.

When the expected values are out of whack, the sequence will stop, to avoid causing damage to components that may be in the wrong position.

Keep us posted.

CC :seeya
 
#3 ·
Hi CC,

Thanks for your quick response and initial diagnosis of the problem; I'm new to this forum, so can you please explain what a "Tech 2 Scan tool" check is. When I spoke with the service rep at the dealership, he did not mention this type of diagnosis.

Also, I'm not sure if the dealership has an XLR Certified Tech, but I will definetly ask them. If they do not have one, would a certified tech come to the dealership to diagnose the problem or would I have to go to a dealership that has one?

and yes, I will definetly keep the forum posted on the diagnosis and solution to this problem. I keep my Car in mint condition and do everything posible to keep it top shape.

I hope that the eventual diagnosis and solution to this problem will help other XLR owners solve similar problems and also help prevent this issues with their cars.

SAM
 
#4 · (Edited)
Hi back,

A Tech 2 (you can use Google to see what one looks like) is a hand-held GM diagnostic tool that dealerships use to peer into the inner working of vehicles. On the XLR, the diagnostic port is located at the base of the steering wheel. The Tech 2 is being replaced by a newer system that uses a laptop. Both are able to store diagnostic routines for all later GM models.

The Tech 2 differs from the kind of scan tool available at auto supply stores which can read powertrain codes. These are one-way communication devices. The Tech 2 is bi-directional and can reset parameters, enter VIN codes to install new entertainment systems, etc.

Press the Door Open switch on the driver's side, and the Tech 2 will display it's status from Inactive to Active. Multiply that by a hundred, and you can readily get a handle on how capable the Tech 2 is. In the shop manuals, the Tech 2 is used in the majority of troubleshooting and alignment procedures.

New for the XLR was the ability to perform a complete, one-button-press diagnostic routine. When the full-blown diagnostic scan starts, each module (there are 23) responds to the Tech 2, announcing it's presence. If any modules contain an error code, a number corresponding to how many codes were affecting the module are displayed. Afterwards, you can go to each module, look at the code, and re-run a specific scan if necessary, clear old codes and re-scan the module again to verify it's got issues. The tool is pricey though -about $1200-2000, so it isn't a tool you want unless you plan to keep the car a long time and enjoy working on vehicles.

I got tired of taking my car in for little issues that I was unable to troubleshoot on my own --like the Folding Top for instance, so I sprung for one. I have two Cadillacs, but the XLR is the only one that has ever had issues requiring a Tech 2. It's nice to have the ability to scan my neighbor's cars.

Anytime you take your XLR to a dealership, (this is for you new people) ask if they have a certified XLR tech. This car has special classes for it's unique systems, and most Cadillac dealerships have at least one. If your dealer doesn't have one, you'll be paying for their education, (--on your car, no less!) so I highly recommend saving yourself a lot of heartache and only let certified techs work on your vehicle. Techs at any dealership can call for tech support, but I'd rather have a tech spend my labor charges in the bay than on the phone.


I hope this answers your questions.

CC :seeya
 
#6 ·
Just an Update from the Dealership:

We received your fax, I would like to thank you for the research that you have provided to us on your vehicle. I have personally been involved in your vehicle in trying to open the trunk. The latch is seized some way causing the trunk not to release, the actuator for the trunk is mounted in the bumper that we need to gain access to. We have gained access to the emergence pull handle in the trunk through the small access above the rear seats. The emergence pull handle will not release the actuator to the latch, also in combination have tried the key in the bumper and used the remote trunk release none will release the trunk as you no. The technician what is working on your vehicle is General Motors certified and is very qualified to work on your vehicle. The problem that we are having on your vehicle is to gain access to the latch and actuator and that is only accessible behind the bumper, and from the trunk that can’t get access to. We have made several calls to General Motors Technical Assistance with the concern, we are waiting for a call back from them to see if there is any other way to gain access. All of the attempts that we

have tried have failed, we are trying to open the trunk without causing any damage to the trunk lid, bumper or to the convertible top system.

We are aware of the diagnoses, the problem is getting to the latch and actuator without causing and damage to the exterior body panels.

When trying to open with the remote you can see the amount of pressure been applied to the trunk, it is trying to open but the latch and actuator are bound together and will not allow the trunk to release. This repair is not as easy as just getting the Tech 2 and pulling up codes

it has to do with getting access to these components to release the hatch without causing major damage. Will try to find out from Technical Assistance as soon as I can, and will let you know the outcome as soon as possible and keep you updated on your vehicle.

I provided the following Suggestions, If any body has any other ideas, would entertain all options:

Steve,

Thank you for the update on XLR; I read quite a few similar problems on the XLR forums, and I thought I might pass
this along to see of any of these ideas are options.

1) Remove the Battery and let the system reset; Some Threads indicated this solved the problem.

2) Perform a S/W upgrade to allow the mechanism to reset (Assuming the H/W is compatible); some threads indicated that S/W upgraded may improve how the mechanism and timing on how the systems unravels.

3) From an Engineering perspective, the message "TOP NOT SECURE" indicates that the TOP is open to a certain degree which would mean this would prevent the trunk from opening. I read in one of the threads that they were able to fool the system that would allow to fully disengage the system. They indicated there is a tool that can be used to fake the system that the system is latched.

Just a few thoughts to consider
 
#7 ·
Sam:

It is important to remember that the key in the bumper is a manual process and is intended to release the trunk lock when all electrical components are dead. It is turned to the right very carefully and the trunk locking claw should release and allow the trunk to raise very slightly. Then you will need to push it open completely.

I would think that if that failed possibly the combination of the manual cable next to the drivers seat AND the key at the same time may produce enough leverage to release it.

Do you know if they tried to use the manual trunk opening lever located outside the trunk and above the license frame? You need to have the FOB close by.

Regarding the battery reset process, all they have to do is to remove the negative cable to the battery for a few minutes and then reconnect it for the system recycle to work.

I would however try the manual access processes while the battery is disconnected in case the system is stuck trying the open cycle.

Regards

Jerry



 
#8 ·
XLR 2006 - TOP and Trunk will not Open

Thanks Jerry,

Received a call from the Dealership indicating that they want me come discuss the issue with them; It appears that they did not solve the problem and/or want to break into the Car to solve the problem.

This is not an option for me; I can't believe GM would build a Car that cannot be fixed in a normal manner.

If I don't get a satisfactory answer; I will take the car to another dealership, but also call Corporate head quarters as well.

If there is a design flaw with the Car; I believe corporate should be involved with this problem.

Again, thanks for your input, and I will keep the forum posted on the status.

SAM :banghead
 
#9 ·
Sam,

Sorry to hear about the progress (or lack thereof) made thus far. The Tech 2 won't open the trunk, only give the status of the rear latch mechanism.
(Which in this case appears mechanically bound.)

Your dealer sounds like one I dealt with when I first moved here. The Service Manager assured me all of their techs were GM-certified. (That answer was the minimum I wanted to hear.) When pressed for XLR credentials, he admitted they didn't have a Certified XLR tech and I continued my search. There is a specific XLR certification for techs that have taken a special GM course. Not every dealership has one.

In your case, it's a formality. If the latch (Rear Compartment Pull-down Actuator) is jammed, there is no way to physically access it without risking damage, and any tech will be hard-pressed to find a quick solution to the problem your car presents.

To clarify somewhat. . . There is no lever above the rear license plate -it's a momentary switch -like the one adjacent to the base of the steering column. There are only five (normal) ways to open the trunk lid: Pressing the fob switch, the rear license plate switch, the switch near the steering wheel, the Top Control switch, and two mechanical methods -the pull switch from inside the trunk, and the release using the key switch in the bumper.

As your dealership already knows, this is what's called a catastophic single-point failure. One inaccessible component fails, and non-destructive solutions aren't readlily available. This is why they're in contact with GM Tech Assistance. Yours is a rare failure and it's going to take some serious brainstorming time to figure out a way to induce the latch to release. If the solenoid is firing and it's still stuck, it's probably a mechanical jam. Jiggling the the release cables for an extended period may induce it to move.

Where I work, when a rare, seemingly impossible, hard-to-fix scenario happens, I'm always amazed at how creative folks can be --like using a borescope and a high pressure air line to move things in out-of-the way places, or inflatable "pillows" to apply mechanical pressure.

--Being a car, space is always tight and you obviously want to keep mechanical and cosmetic damage to an absolute minimum. I'm sure they've pulled the rear/center console between the seats to gain limited access to the trunk. There isn't much to work with. And yes, design limitations cannot take every failure situation into account --like making the scews that secure the rear decklid accessible from between the seats. The mechanical cables are supposed to work when power is lost. 99% of the time. . .

I'm sure I'm not the only one following this thread to see how they are able to fix it without resorting to cutting the rear decklid apart. Kind of makes me want to lubricate my car's release latch . . .

Good luck and hang in there!

CC :grouphug
 
#10 ·
Sam:

CC is the undisputed tech expert here and as he mentioned I really don't recall ever reading about a issue like this since I have been on the site. So your issue is very rare indeed.

IF I WERE YOU-what I would want to know is;
1. Whether they did disconnect the battery and allow a reset to occur.
2. Whether they tried the manual entry processes with the battery disconnected.

If you give up on these guys and go to another dealer these are things you can try yourself BEFORE anyone tries to take a touch out and cut a hole in your car.

THERE ARE ENGINEERS THAT ARE XLR KNOWLEDGEABLE THAT STILL WORK FOR CADILLAC so ask to get them involved.

You might PM CC and take a ride to his dealer to see if they can resolve the issue.

Very Best Wishes

Jerry



 
#12 ·
To All,

Just a an update on the Situation; I stopped by the Dealership to discuss the problem encountered; They managed to remove middle storage box to gain access to the rear.

They used a Borescope to view in the back; they lowered the barrier and moved out the items (umbrella and window visor) to view the rear. They indicated that there must be something jamming the manual release lever since they see it move, but still cannot open the trunk manually. They indicated to me that the rear motors are behind the plate, so they are having difficult time understanding how the mechanism is working.

I did ask if they have an XLR technical expert, and the answer is no. They indicated thay they rarely see these Vehicles at their dealership, and their Mechanics don't have that level of experience working on this type of problem.

1) They indicated they did follow the suggestion provided and disconnected the Battery
to allow a reset.
2) THey did disconnect the Battery and tried to gain manual entry.

I did mention to them that I did notice that the display indicated "TOP NOT SECURE" when i attempted to Open/Close the top after a few failures. They mentioned to me that they attached the "TECH 2" device, and indicated that the message was cleared from the system. Without trying this myself, I'm not sure if this would show up again.

They also mentioned that in order to understand how the mechanism works, they need another Car so that they can compare how the release works.

Based on my conversation with them today; they just don't have the experience to understand the mechanics of the top and mechanism to fully diagnose the problem.

The Service Manager is trying his best, but he see's my frustration with regards to not being able to solve this problem. I mentioned that I will call Corporate to disucss this situation from an owner perspective.

The XLR was supposed to be GM/Cadillac's flagship Car; If there is a design defect that was not anticipated during the Engineering of the Top and Trunk; I believe it is in the best interest that GM knows of the problem and has their Engineers work this problem so that it is solved in future designs of the car.

I'm a S/W Engineer by trait, so when I see a problem like that is (Mechnical/SW), I work
to resolve the problem so that it does not occur again. That is how we qualify equipment before it goes out to the field.

I will keep the forum posted on the status, but for now, I will try to contact another XLR owner to see if they can bring their car to the dealership so that they can see how the mechanism is working.

Any volunteer's out there?
 
#38 ·
I have been out of the loop for a bit and have just seen this thread. While they might not have an XLR tech, this reads to me like they are doing an excellent job, the problem is not, by my reading, an XLR specific problem per-se but is a mechanical failure of the latch release mechanism. The only way is going to be to break that latch or force the latch off its mountings somehow. Tricky.

A piece of information that might help. There is a compartment sill plate that fits over the latch, about the full width of the trunk. IF (and I mean IF) they can smash that apart in the middle section (maybe 2-2 1/2 feet of it), there are three 10mm nuts that hold the latch to the bracket. These are at the top of the latch. The one on the left is a short bolt, the middle and right hand ones are on long bolts. If (again if) they can get those nuts off, the latch has to be pulled forwards off the bolts, maybe 2 1/2 inches. The lid though will resist this. If that can be done, the trunk lid will be free, with the latch dangling off it.

The power connector is on the right and both the emergency handle and key cables are on the left. There is not a lot of slack in the electrical loom.

It is very odd that pulling the emergency release and the key cables do not release the catch. Internally those cables pull on the same mechanism, I forget which way round, one works both, one just the one, but either release the latch.

Another other option does need an XLR manual at least, and that is to remove the bracket that holds the latch on. That procedure starts by removing the rear wheels and might be a way in. It also requires removal of the rear lamps, which needs the trunk open.... It is in sections 8-28, 8-61, 8-73 and 8-571 of the 2004 manual.

All the best
 
#17 ·
CC,

Thanks for you input once again; If you have time, can you contact your dealership to see if they know of one in the So Cal area (San Bernardino preferably) that has an XLR Tech. I appreciate all your insight and input to date. I'll perform some cold calling, but if there is a way to find out if a dealearship is certified with such a mechanic, that would be a good help.
 
#20 ·
SAM:

CC has a very good idea that I would like to modify a little;

Call Cadillac Customer Service open a formal problem report and upward manage your problem within Cadillac. Let them tell you the best place to take your car and get it fixed. Also suggest they fly someone in that knows what needs to be done befor some serious damage is done.

BTW did you by the car from a private party or a Cadillac Dealer? If it was a dealer get them involved at the owner General Manager level.

I have reposted my How To Get Into The Xlr With No Battery or Power Document in the TECHNICAL SECTION > Top and Trunk Operation. It's a sticky at the top of the topic.

We're here to help.

Best Wishes

Jerry



 
#21 ·
Jerry,

Thanks to the suggestions provided from yourself and CC, that is exactly what I will do.

The dealearship called thursday to let me know that in the process of diagnosing the vehicle, that they broke the emergency release cable while trying to open the Vehicle.

They mentioned that they would pay for the cable and installation, but that is not the point. If that was the only way to open the Vehilcle, that option is now lost and the complexity to solve this problem has increased.

I read your article on the trunk release, and I'm not sure if they put WD-40 in the slot to free the stick mechanism. But that option is now gone.

I will be picking up the Vehicle today to bring it home until I take further action calling Caddillac Customer Service.

I'm in a potentially catastropic mode; If the Battery ever goes dead, the Car will need to be broken into to access the Vehicle.

If this is a design flaw in the Vehicle; Caddillac needs to know, and fix the problem for all existing customers. It's a very Dangerous situation if both failures occur simultaneously.
Car will be stranded with potentially now way to move it.

SAM
 
#22 · (Edited)
To avoid any issues if the battery were to go dead, I recommend keeping it parked in the garage with the driver's side window fully lowered to allow access to the door lever and mechancial hood release.

Of course, using a Battery Tender will decrease the likelyhood of having a dead battery.

You still have a mechanical lifeline to the latch --from the bumper lock. Jiggling that cable while bouncing the position of the rear decklid may pop the latch. Does the latch solenoid activate when the fob, or any switch to open the trunk is pressed?

CC
 
#23 ·
CC,

Thanks for the advice, That is what I will do from now on every night until I get the car correctly diagnosed and fixed. I'll just make sure to place a cover to keep the dust out.

Quick question on the Battery Tender; Can you explain what a battery tender is? where would I find the right model for this Car, and how it is installed. A model or website reference would be great.

Also, to answer your question, yes, the soleniod still does activate to open the trunk, but it appears that the latch is stuck and will not release.

I do have a trouble ticket with Cadillac Customer Service open, and I will be visiting the dealership on Monday to discuss further plans to resolve.

Thanks,

SAM
 
#25 ·
Sam:

With all of the technical attention paid to your car it is important to remind any new mechanics and other technicians that in order for the top to work;

1. The windows will need to be reindexed.
2. The package separator in the trunk will need to be put back in place somehow.

So attempting to open the trunk will need to be the focus.

Battery Tender-- Google it and you'll see what it looks like. The are small alligator clips that are attached to the battery--red--positive and black- negative and plug it in. Always attach the red first and black second. When removing unplug the unit and take the black off first and keep the clips separated.

Regards

Jerry



 
#27 · (Edited)
Wow.....this is not what I was hoping to read here. I have the exact same problem caused by a different sequence of events.

To start with, the car sat for several months and had a dead battery. I used the bumper key mechanism to open the trunk. At this point I thought the handle by the trunk latch was supposed to open the doors so I pulled it. Obviously nothing happened so I continued until I located the actual door release cable. This was all great, I got the battery charged and closed the trunk. Minutes later when getting ready to leave the garage I tried to open the trunk and it would not unlatch. The front of the lid lifted as the motors tried to open it but the latch just wouldn't release. I tried using the bumper key again but this time it did nothing. I read through this thread hoping to see a solution at the end but I guess I'm in the same situation as XLR-SAM now.

I also noticed that the windows will not automatically go to the fully up position after closing the doors now. The door switch will raise them but they don't raise when the doors are shut.
 
#28 · (Edited)
Sounds like more than one issue. Disconnect the battery, wait five minutes, and re-connect. Index the windows, and try to open the rear decklid again.

A dead battery will cause the window indexing position to be lost. Re-index the windows (as per the manual) and they should be okay. The folding top will not work if the window indexing feature is disabled. It's the first thing checked when the Folding Top sequence is initiated since the Folding Top module has to verify the windows are lowered.

I advise getting a Battery Tender and religiously using it if the car is parked for extended periods. (The XLR always has a draw on the battery in case you walk up to it with a fob.) Once a battery goes dead, it starts to sulphate and it's power/life is diminished.

CC :seeya
 
#29 · (Edited)
Yes, I did try disconnecting the battery. It has to be an issue with the latch because even with the battery disconnected the bumper key will not release the latch. When I pulled on the cable in the trunk, thinking it was the door release, I felt a slight pop. Even if I overpulled the inside trunk release, I don't see how this would cause the trunk latch to jam up.

I did try lowering the top to see if this would open the trunk lid. The windows did go down before the top tried to retract so they appear to be functioning correctly.

It looks like there is no solution when the latch is malfunctioning. is there no other way to gain access to the latch mechanism?
 
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